tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post6573446110225253555..comments2024-03-18T16:37:30.718-04:00Comments on Insecure Writer's Support Group: Rules, Guidelines, and Just Plain Bad Advice by Lynda Dietz, EditorAlex J. Cavanaughhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09770065693345181702noreply@blogger.comBlogger36125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-59648923586893798012018-10-12T23:43:34.423-04:002018-10-12T23:43:34.423-04:00Lisa, I'm glad you enjoyed it! Many editors I ...Lisa, I'm glad you enjoyed it! Many editors I know hate the "zombie rules" that writers follow without knowing why (or if they're valid at all).<br /><br />Spacer Guy, now you have me thinking of Reginald Barclay from STNG with the "demonstrate my powers which I can feel growing already" comment.<br /><br />Cara, the ???? abuse bothers me almost as much as the people who use the question mark when there's no question. Like, "I saw a guy by the side of the road. I can't believe these people?" Uggghh. Where is the question? And I know someone who never caps "i" and it makes me twitch. <br /><br />Liesbet, thank you so much! I agree, so often people try too hard to enforce rules, with a result of the writing becoming bland and no longer unique. So many editors I know try really hard to not be the police, but rather the "let's make this as pleasantly readable as possible" helper. Lynda Dietzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15442214431341019380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-17324588941105375542018-10-09T12:20:38.670-04:002018-10-09T12:20:38.670-04:00Fantastic article, Lynda. I think writers should h...Fantastic article, Lynda. I think writers should have some freedom with these guidelines/rules, as this would be a part of their voice. Especially the short sentences do the trick for building up tension or reflecting the action/feelings of the protagonist. I use this technique in my memoir a few times and like to keep it. The point is brought across without full, winding sentences. My word count is too high as it is. :-)Liesbethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13402741679152508367noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-5985261080635632962018-10-03T14:45:32.091-04:002018-10-03T14:45:32.091-04:00My only rule is that rules are for fools. ;-)
Like...My only rule is that rules are for fools. ;-)<br />Like deadlines, I prefer rules to be soft. <br />Actually, I do tend to follow the basic rules. I hate the current tendency of question mark abuse and lack of capitalization. darn these kids and their question mark abuse???? am i right???? Yeah, that drives me bats.Ornery Owl of Naughty Netherworld Press and Readers Roost https://www.blogger.com/profile/07596105116325246476noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-2348587337814223522018-10-02T18:22:53.658-04:002018-10-02T18:22:53.658-04:00Cinderkeys and Nicole, the "said" rule/a...Cinderkeys and Nicole, the "said" rule/advice is hammered so strongly on both sides that it makes me crazy to think of so many people blindly following either way. I've seen so many things OTHER than "said" that I've been pulled out of the story. And sometimes I've seen ONLY "said" and thought of how it would be nice to have a "whispered" here and there.<br /><br />Knowledge is nothing without wisdom.Lynda Dietzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15442214431341019380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-49662017437723911052018-10-02T13:08:52.430-04:002018-10-02T13:08:52.430-04:00We put so much emotion into our writing but is tha...We put so much emotion into our writing but is that a good thing? In the old days we used to believe the world was a scary place ruled by ogres and evil entities, witches and all that nonsense but who buys into that make believe and fear anymore. Thank you for helping me to expand my vocabulary because now I'll be able to demonstrate my powers which I can feel growing already, hehe.SpacerGuyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05575342869714342370noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-40892800430662906862018-10-01T10:54:50.852-04:002018-10-01T10:54:50.852-04:00Thank you thank you thank you! Love hearing this f...Thank you thank you thank you! Love hearing this from an editor.Lisahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06658507579160418855noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-52056737476579744602018-09-29T21:03:14.297-04:002018-09-29T21:03:14.297-04:00The rule that bugs me the most is the "said&q...The rule that bugs me the most is the "said" one. I prefer using and showing the emotions in other ways. Nicole Pyleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06920135146911951755noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-71831469439993148272018-09-29T13:23:35.398-04:002018-09-29T13:23:35.398-04:00Oops. "...another bad-writing-advice rule tha...Oops. "...another bad-writing-advice rule that tells us never to use anything BUT 'said.'"cinderkeyshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01578961959712679966noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-65712658298261232692018-09-29T13:12:46.041-04:002018-09-29T13:12:46.041-04:00Avoiding "said" is one of those fake rul...Avoiding "said" is one of those fake rules thought up by well-intentioned hypercorrectors. They've absorbed the good advice about avoiding repetition of words and phrases and applied it to the one place where repetition is invisible.<br /><br />As Alicia Butcher Ehrhardt alluded to, you can break up dialogue tags with beats and lines of dialogue where there's no attribution at all. But when you use tags, you can get away with "said" forever.<br /><br />There's another bad-writing-advice rule that tells us NEVER to use "said." While it's a good idea not to go too wild with the tags, it's fine to substitute something else every once in a while.cinderkeyshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01578961959712679966noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-68778903687515652812018-09-29T09:10:47.539-04:002018-09-29T09:10:47.539-04:00Susan, Picasso sure seemed to know what he was tal...Susan, Picasso sure seemed to know what he was talking about, even if he did put noses on the sides of people's ears in his paintings. An artist should always have flexibility to make their art unique, and rule-breaking (or recognizing guidelines) is part of that.<br /><br />Joylene, thank you so much for commenting and sharing, too!<br /><br />Alexandra, I love semicolons, too. And there's nothing wrong with them, so you're probably using them well. Don't let anyone tell you they're illegal in some states<br /><br />Toi, some rules need to be restrictive—we don't want anarchy, after all—but people must apply wisdom to the knowledge they collect or it's all garbage in the end. That's when rules can feel like they're in the way more than being helpful. Thanks for the comment!Lynda Dietzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15442214431341019380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-57281173037635679072018-09-28T18:43:03.006-04:002018-09-28T18:43:03.006-04:00Great post.
Guidelines are helpful, but rules are ...Great post.<br />Guidelines are helpful, but rules are restrictive. Rules serve a purpose, but mostly they just get in the way.Toi Thomashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07493934864387695248noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-63380343914998701082018-09-28T16:23:06.977-04:002018-09-28T16:23:06.977-04:00I'm pretty sure I'm doing everything wrong...I'm pretty sure I'm doing everything wrong, then. Especially since I love semicolons. Good thing I don't care much for rules--after I understand them enough to break them. <br /><br />Thank you for the post. I enjoyed it!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-50297042981005053752018-09-28T11:49:52.696-04:002018-09-28T11:49:52.696-04:00Thank you for this excellent post, Lynda. Well rec...Thank you for this excellent post, Lynda. Well received and shared everywhere. Joylene Nowell Butlerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04497637513532136615noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-84959008427272383462018-09-28T11:46:54.588-04:002018-09-28T11:46:54.588-04:00Someone... Picasso, I think... said, "Learn t...Someone... Picasso, I think... said, "Learn the rules like a pro so you can break them like an artist." I think writers should have a basic understanding of grammatical and punctuation rules, but bending over backwards to make their writing adhere to some arbitrary "rule" stifles creativity and diminishes the potential value of their work.<br /><br />Great post! Thank you.Susan Flett Swiderskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09425315552148200073noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-69990610105250436072018-09-26T22:45:10.368-04:002018-09-26T22:45:10.368-04:00JT, thanks for being such a loyal reader of the st...JT, thanks for being such a loyal reader of the stuff I spit out. Bumpy road, boat or not, I'm glad you trust me to do what I do.<br /><br />Damyanti, isn't it amazing how much things change when taken in and out of context? And I appreciate the double visit and comments!<br /><br />Melissa, thank you!<br /><br />Hilary, you may claim to not know the official rules, but I think your writing is interesting and easy to understand. And really, that's what it's all about. Thanks for visiting both posts today!Lynda Dietzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15442214431341019380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-27993805226418273102018-09-26T15:28:56.716-04:002018-09-26T15:28:56.716-04:00Hi Lynda - lovely post ... you always explain thin...Hi Lynda - lovely post ... you always explain things so well. I don't know the rules - and I really should - but as long as people appreciate what I'm writing then I'm fine. I guess - when it came to a submission ... I'd have to accept the replies would be full (if I was lucky) of red lines ... still life goes on. Lovely interesting comments you've got from others too - and thanks for this - cheers HilaryHilary Melton-Butcherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17596532480645510678noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-58437987532695094572018-09-25T23:16:16.787-04:002018-09-25T23:16:16.787-04:00We must know all the rules before breaking them, b...We must know all the rules before breaking them, but once we know them, they're meant to be broken in service of the character or the story.<br /><br />I love your list--most of them are bits of advice taken totally out of context, now masquerading as rules.<br /><br /><a href="https://www.damyantiwrites.com" rel="nofollow">Damyanti</a>Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04283371140346602856noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-38216357710870203702018-09-25T21:33:53.601-04:002018-09-25T21:33:53.601-04:00What? Not write in complete sentences? I completel...What? Not write in complete sentences? I completely agree. If someone consistently writes in all complete sentences, it feels stilted, less real. I have never heard of not using semicolons; without them, I wouldn't have any idea how to write creatively or not sound like I am on a bumpy road. Or writing in a boat. Okay I am through breaking "rules" now. Everyone have a great evening.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15947591878587796778noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-53192746746045239942018-09-25T16:41:02.474-04:002018-09-25T16:41:02.474-04:00Tyrean, one of my high school teachers required th...Tyrean, one of my high school teachers required that we always answer a question with a full sentence that had the question in it, so the reader would know from the answer what the question was. It was tedious but a great exercise for formal writing like what you're teaching. It all has its place.<br /><br />T. Powell, that's terrific—"I love rules and guidelines until I don't." I'm right there with you. And thanks for the THREE exclamations!<br /><br />Patricia, that's the beauty of it, right? If you know what they are, then breaking them judiciously isn't such a crime.<br /><br />Dolorah, the editing communities I'm part of are pretty wonderful about the changing language. They all stress the not-so-flattering editor reputation and how we are supposed to be here to help, not scold. They've taught me to be flexible, which makes for happier writers who still put out a good product.<br /><br />Diedre, thank you for the encouragement!Lynda Dietzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15442214431341019380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-54092477038595887532018-09-25T16:10:31.615-04:002018-09-25T16:10:31.615-04:00A reassuring beacon in a choppy sea of rules! Than...A reassuring beacon in a choppy sea of rules! Thank you, Lynda ;-)diedre Knighthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12772557495518846226noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-83757814555588843892018-09-25T14:59:06.851-04:002018-09-25T14:59:06.851-04:00My kind of editor :) If something works, it does. ...My kind of editor :) If something works, it does. I agree about the "over use" of any style. I love books on writing, but have noticed that after a while, they all say the same things about the "rules" or all contradict each other. A flexible editor in valuable for a writer.dolorahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08715849844092553699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-5907023719696211882018-09-25T12:02:27.280-04:002018-09-25T12:02:27.280-04:00I'm a firm believer in rules are made to be br...I'm a firm believer in rules are made to be broken. Not all the time. It's a case by case basis, but I think it's a good approach.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-36095695936718727802018-09-25T07:04:56.187-04:002018-09-25T07:04:56.187-04:00A girl after my own heart!!! (Yes, that was three ...A girl after my own heart!!! (Yes, that was three exclamations.) I love rules and guidelines until I don't. Great article, Lynda. T. Powell Coltrinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02160774009926623671noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-25895422608745829122018-09-24T21:32:14.757-04:002018-09-24T21:32:14.757-04:00Oops, and here I am commenting from my teacher e-m...Oops, and here I am commenting from my teacher e-mail. Sorry about that.Tyreanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11527093820689097636noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3136420115688099157.post-43743230461212242322018-09-24T21:31:53.553-04:002018-09-24T21:31:53.553-04:00Love your tips! Although as an English teacher try...Love your tips! Although as an English teacher trying to help my students get their writing ready for college essays, the SAT essay, and other more hidebound essay assignments, I generally tell my students to never use an incomplete sentence for essays in my class. What they do after that is up to them. I know that it's not really a hard rule for life, but it helps with those young writers tempted to put these sentences in the middle of their essays: "Definitely. Really."<br /><br /><br /><br />Tyreanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11527093820689097636noreply@blogger.com